Re: Was Anakin suppose to turn to the Dark Side? « Reply #1 on Oct 7, 2006, 10:20pm »
My gut feeling is 'no.' I think that the Force meant it to happen quickly and decisively. However, human choice enters the picture as well as demonic influences. Beings must then deal with the results of their choices. Anakin's results were horrific. Actually, the entire galaxy suffered because of his choices.
Say all you want to about love and attachment and the Jedi Order... He could have worked within the Council for change instead of disobeying the rules and marrying, for one. That marriage, as well as the slaughter of the Sand People, were choices that pushed him down the dark path.
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Re: Was Anakin suppose to turn to the Dark Side? « Reply #2 on Oct 7, 2006, 10:55pm »
I don't think Anakin was meant to turn. If he was, it would mean the Force is not a benevolent thing, since no benevolent deity would demand the slaughter of millions of innocents in exchange for balance.
Anakin's turn was a result of catastrophic choices. And those choices were the results of years of manipulations and ignorance on everyone's part. Everyone was catering to Sidious' plans years before Anakin was even born, and it only got worse from there. Indeed, Anakin himself wasn't even that necessary for Sidious' plan. The Clones and Dooku would have been more than enough to exterminate the Jedi over a longer period of time. Anakin just shortened the timeframe of that to place the Empire in power quicker than it otherwise might have occurred.
The question in my mind is whether Anakin would have been able to defeat Sidious as a regular Jedi Knight. For me, the answer is no. He would have been too limited in his power and vision had he followed the rules, and when it came time to fight the Sith, Sidious would have crushed him.
An extra edge was needed to defeat Sidious. I think the Force gave him that edge in his love for Padme. The problem is that Anakin chose to misuse that edge and damn himself to the dark side. Instead of allowing his love for Padme to strengthen him, it weakened him into believing the lies of a man who was clearly evil incarnate. When Sidious had killed Mace, Anakin should have attacked him right there. Instead he let himself fall deeper under his spell, using his love for Padme as an excuse to gain power. That's not the way you reward love and devotion from someone. You don't go on a rampage against everything that's important to them, and then expect them to stand beside you as if you did nothing wrong.
In fact, had he stopped to think clearly, he would realized Sidious was most likely behind the threat to Padme in the first place. Why would he make it clear that he knew about Anakin's dream and what would happen to Padme, unless he was the one behind that dream in the first place? Sidious set him up for a fall and Anakin walked right into it.
Re: Was Anakin suppose to turn to the Dark Side? « Reply #3 on Oct 8, 2006, 8:36am »
Quote:
I don't think Anakin was meant to turn. If he was, it would mean the Force is not a benevolent thing, since no benevolent deity would demand the slaughter of millions of innocents in exchange for balance.
I personally don't equate the Force to a deity, nor anything close to what Western societies usually term in religion. I see the Force as simply a binding Force, an energy, that flows through everything. I do not think that the Force is either benevolent nor malevolent. While some Jedi speak of the Will of the Force, I think what they're referring to is the course that events seem to be following based on their clairvoyent understanding of the events going around them at the time.
On the topic of whether Anakin was meant to turn, you know technically Lucas directs the Will of the Force...
Re: Was Anakin suppose to turn to the Dark Side? « Reply #4 on Oct 8, 2006, 10:26am »
Speaking of the creator of the Force, Lucas has left it nebulous and obscure purposely. His desire was for people to make of the Force whatever they read into it.
For Christian fans, most see the Force as God, Who doesn't CAUSE things but allows them to happen for a greater good. That is easily seen in the trilogy. There are also Eastern ways of thought; there is Zoroastrianism; there is even Wicca, if you look for it. One can even put a secular spin on the Force. It is whatever it means to the individual. I really think Lucas meant that to happen.
How this relates to Anakin's turning...and this is scary...I agree with PH...AGAIN! Something is wrong here!
pyramidhead316 Jedi Master Our Favorite Boy Toy member is offline
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Re: Was Anakin suppose to turn to the Dark Side? « Reply #6 on Oct 8, 2006, 3:48pm »
Personally, I don't think of the Force as one single deity. I think of it more as the embodiment of the realm after this life, whcih also happens to intertwine with this one. The souls of the dead, combined with the energy of the living, and yes, even any gods or God if they happen to exist. It's all part of the tapestry of the Force, and the Force is existence itself.
If the Force indeed has a Will, then it's probably the sum of all the people who have passed on, and exist in the realm beyond our physical reality. Thankfully, it seems more to lean towards the light. Probably since just one evil person can cause a lot of damage, many good people are needed to balance it out.
That's why I doubt the Force meant for Anakin to turn. It may have *allowed* it, but not without a fight. The unusually strong and quick bond between him and Padme could be seen as an attempt to derail his fall, and Luke was clearly feeling a strong urge to redeem his father. Considering how traumatized Luke must have been after Bespin and the fact that he barely knew anything about Anakin's past, it's quite possible that wasn't just blind faith and a teensy bit of love; it was actually the Force directing him to bring back Anakin from the dark side. The time was right: Vader's devotion to the dark side was clearly wavering, and Sidious had dug himself into a hole that while designed to destroy the Rebels, had also given them the perfect opportunity to destroy him.
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